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Author Topic: Couple of Questions ??  (Read 3379 times)

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Offline Dave2302

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Couple of Questions ??
« on: March 27, 2012, 08:53:37 AM »
Hi Guys,

Puma is now up and running and has had a short road test in 2wd Mode.
Sounds and goes awesome, well pleased....................but...................

A couple of things have come to light which I'm not sure if they are issues or not ??

Firstly I'm using XR4X4 Electric Pump brakes with no ABS, brakes are excellent on the road with hardly any pedal travel at all.
There are no leaks anywhere, they have been bled out since before Xmas.
As soon as I touch the brakes the pump starts up, also when left overnight it runs for a few seconds, (5 - 8), when I turn on the ignition next morning..............
Now this may be normal, but I never noticed it before on my old Sierra but this car has the pump remote mounted so this is more noticeable as it's a tad noisier because it "drums" thru the bulkhead................Is this normal behaviour ??

2nd thing, my engine Idles at 900 rpm (live Data, V6 BOB on 24V Mondeo ECU), but my Rev Counter sits at around 1200 RPM and appears to read high all the way up, (will do a cal against live data later).
I am aware in the "Old Days" we had 4 and 6 cyl Rev Counters but thought they went out with the Ark LOL
The car, (Puma), originally had EDIS Ignition, with EECV ECU, so does the BOB, the Tacho Signal comes from the ECU...................
Now I understood Tachos on modern Fords with EDIS were like a 2 cylinder rev counter due to the wasted spark, so I thought it should read right even though the car was originally a 4Cyl, and then I thought even if it's info is coming from ECU via CPS it should still read right 4 or 6 cylinder, or have I missed something here??
Anyone else come across this with EECV / EDIS??

No other issues apart from it doesn't like cranking when hot, but I think the battery may well be suspect as it used to go flat on the Scorpio LOL, or I may need a proper 4X4 Starter Motor, as I have a half Puma half BOB creation on it atm, just a little investigation needed there LOL.

Other than the above the short Road test revaled that the car is frickin awesome, can't wait to get some mileage on it, just a few jobs left now ;)

Cheers Dave


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Offline fordrwd4ever

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2012, 09:50:52 AM »
The brakeservo pump should be running for a few seconds when you start the car.
The pressure reservoir isn`t big and it looses pressure when not used.

The pump works when the pressure is too low in the reservoir.
So i turns on after every 5 of 6 times using the brakes.

Keep it very sideways..

Offline TimoXr4i

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2012, 11:50:08 AM »
I think youre right on the revcounter, if its a 4 cilinder version, counting like a twin cilinder, it wil have 2/3 of the revs on the meter. Im no electronics expert, but ive been told you cold even get a 6 cilinder version revcounter working just fine on a wasted spark dis system, ysing a few zener diodes, but, im no expert, and as long as im using my old ignition there is no need for changing, but, maybe someone here knows it?

Offline Matt

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2012, 17:00:31 PM »
If you need a scorpio 24v clock to play with ive got a couple spares mate
24v Manual Scorpio **FDS2000 Scans - Birmingham**

Offline Lemon-Ade

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2012, 18:02:46 PM »
Great up date mate, all up and running  :mellow: my pump sounds exactly as yours is so I think it's fine mate.The 4 pot cos in mine did the same so I used the 6 pot one and it sorted it.
Cheers ade

Run in ......

Offline capri v8 driver

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2012, 19:42:36 PM »
Quote
I am aware in the "Old Days" we had 4 and 6 cyl Rev Counters but thought they went out with the Ark LOL
The car, (Puma), originally had EDIS Ignition, with EECV ECU, so does the BOB, the Tacho Signal comes from the ECU...................
Now I understood Tachos on modern Fords with EDIS were like a 2 cylinder rev counter due to the wasted spark, so I thought it should read right even though the car was originally a 4Cyl, and then I thought even if it's info is coming from ECU via CPS it should still read right 4 or 6 cylinder, or have I missed something here??

You need a 6 cylinder rev counter.

In older vehicles, the tachometer is driven by the RMS voltage waves from the minus side of the ignition coil, Edis uses a square wave signal. Except from the signal, the frequency is the same. So its not a 2 or 3 cylinder tacho, but a 4 or 6 cylinder tacho. Even today its still the same.

greetz Paul.

Capri V8 Driver.

Offline robrs2

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2012, 20:32:55 PM »
900/4 = 225
225 *6 = 1350 rpm

Would look like you need the v6 rev counter. But it is possible to mod the old one. Don't know the details though.

Offline Dave2302

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2012, 08:58:45 AM »
Thanks for the replies.............

OK, so brake pump is fine that's good.

Still don't understand the rev conter, but I understand the maths.
If you look at the wiring of an early module type Edis, ONE of its coil trigger wires feeds the rev counter so whether it's 4 or 6 cylinder that will only fire once per engine revolution, but then when EDIS modules disappeared, and the triggers were from the ECU, like mine, the Tacho is wired to the ECU........................I suppose that means the tacho / circuit board is different again then ??

Problem is this is a digital type Puma / Fiesta dash, so I may have to try and stick the Guts of a Scorpio one in the Puma Clock Set, because unlike Sierras there was never a 6 cylinder Puma / Fiesta.................

That brings another problem to mind, the "guts" are just like 4 coils, they turn the spindle, so that probably means something like a chip or transistor etc on the circuit board needs changing, and there my friends I wouldn't have a clue !!

Any electronics experts amongst you understand this and had a Fiesta / Puma Clock set with Digita Mileage apart so you know exactly what I mean, I had this hassle with the temp gauge and fitted analogue guts from an earlier Fiesta to sort that !!

It's a similair but not the same circuit board as a Bug Eye Scorpio Cosworth Dash if that helps ;)

Cheers Dave
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Offline fordrwd4ever

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2012, 09:19:00 AM »
This can be done by using a divider.
You have to multiply the incoming pulses by 2 and then divide them by 2.
(so you get 2/3 of the pulses to the rev counter)

There should be a schematic on the net somewhere...
I can design one, but this will take some time :-[

 
Keep it very sideways..

Offline Dave2302

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2012, 11:57:24 AM »
Surely that's a typo, should it not read multiply by 2 then divide by 3 ???

Cheers Dave
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Offline fordrwd4ever

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2012, 12:38:44 PM »
Oops...
You are right, it`s multiply by 2 then divide by 3.

I have found something that`s usable, just need to test it out first.
Should be 2 simple CMOS logic chips and some small passive components.

BTW, @ which voltage does the signal have?
is it 5 volts or 12 Volts?
Does matter for the chips i am planning to use :angel:
Keep it very sideways..

Offline Dave2302

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Re: Couple of Questions ??
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2012, 17:20:47 PM »
I'll have to find that out for you, the signal is taken from a pin on the (1997 Manual V6 Mondeo ECU)

Will get back to you unless anyone else can tell us ??
Off out now
Thanks Dave
It's nice to be important but
It's more important to be nice

 

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