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auto box probelm/intersting one

Started by maddoldbugger, August 24, 2007, 21:55:20 PM

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maddoldbugger

August 24, 2007, 21:55:20 PM Last Edit: August 24, 2007, 21:55:49 PM by maddoldbugger
on the way to work i suddenly lost drive, it would pull away but it took loads of revs to pull away at a snails pace.
i got the car home and took a look today
first check was oil.....nice and red..... level at max

nownt wrong there

so tryed to drive the car, it was fine for a mile or so then played up again,,, i then tryed locking it in D1 it drove as it should do  

hhhmmmm
so i tryed it in D2 yeah it selects 1st then  2nd and holds,, as it should do!!  

hhhhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm
next it tryed D3 ow and this drives normaly, kicks down as it should and changes as it should

ok i thought,, try D
doh. no drive, just creaps forward..

so i now have to drive in D3,, this means i have no 4th gear,, now this i understand is the overdrive gear,, but i dont understand why its doing it..

is it

clutch damaged for 3/4 gear (but how does it work ok when not selected?)

fault on brain (valve body)

dunno, me thinks im doing a box change soon

Dave


I will ask me mate.

When in D the box works different to when you select 123.

Yes of course everyone now says but there is more to it than that.

Hard to explain  

Did you find any bits in the oil then

maddoldbugger

August 24, 2007, 23:30:52 PM #2 Last Edit: August 24, 2007, 23:33:41 PM by maddoldbugger
dave, the oil is clear and red! no bits as far as i can see!!

what i wanna know is how does the ecu know its in D3?
OR
does the valve body (auto brain) bypass the 4th gear?
if so, i cant understand how it works ok in D3 but not in D

i did check the vss,, speedo still working,, and the t/c lockup still works and so does kick down???

tony

capri v8 driver

you have 1, 2 and 3e gear. do you still have reverse? coud it be that the selector on the gearbox is adjusted wrong so if you select D, the lever on the gearbox is between D and N ? this gives you the same symtomes.

greetz paul.
capri v8 driver.
greetz Paul.

Capri V8 Driver.

maddoldbugger

paul
yes i have reverse and i have looked at the selector its fine, goes in all other gears ,park and neutral...i have even got kickdown????????
all i have is a very slight dragging when in D,, it will pull away but very slowly and it has to rev to 5k to do it...

my understanding so far,,could be wrong

in D the "auto brain" allows oil pressure to the verius valves including 3/4th solniod.
in 3D, the auto box closes the 3/4 solinoid supply, thus does not select 4th gear and holds in 3rd. it doesnt need to let the engine ecu know as it just doesnt allow selection machanicly.
ok
if i have a blown oil seal on the 3/4 soliniod, it could be dropping the oil pressure so low it doesnt select any gears, or it does but the clutches do not hold as they should due to low oil pressure.
hence the slight dragging i have in  D.
once i select D3 it closes the supply to 3/4 soliniod, i dont have the pressure loss and the box works in every respect but for 4th gear..


that cant be far off whats going on!

tony

capri v8 driver

i woud first replace the valvebody.

it coud be that there is a leak whitin the body or a leak between the body and the main case. or a sticky valve does, opens or closes or leaks. also check the overdrive servo for leaking o ring's and if the servo work's. i dont know if you are using a shift kit, maybe something came lose. a screw or spring maybe.

2e: i dont know if your gearbox still has it, check the governor on the output shaft, the valve in there needs to move freely.

3e:

if that not helps to solve the problem, than i think  that you have to look at the clutch plate's and the forward clutch, maybe they are burned or the plates or the drum are sticky or the seals are leaking. also check the checkball in the drum's maybe it's leaking or stuck.

greetz paul.
capri v8 driver.
greetz Paul.

Capri V8 Driver.

maddoldbugger

paul
if i have to start stripping it out i will change the box for the r55 i have

just hope it lasts as it is, didnt really wanna do it right now

tony

capri v8 driver

August 26, 2007, 08:55:22 AM #7 Last Edit: August 26, 2007, 08:55:38 AM by capri v8 driver
replacing the valve body is a 15 minut job. if it still does not work, than you will be in for more work.

i can believe your not waiting for this.

but my best gues at this moment is the valvebody or a leaking gasket between the body and the box, because it does get into the gear's when you shift manualy.

greetz apul.
capri v8 driver.
greetz Paul.

Capri V8 Driver.

Dave

August 26, 2007, 11:04:17 AM #8 Last Edit: August 26, 2007, 11:13:32 AM by Dave
Worth a go Tone  

Was thinking, it may be just some crap somewhere as you had that burst oil cooler & been messing with the oil generally  


maddoldbugger

when your working on a drive its not a 15min job.
ow and i need to dropp the exhaust system to
na, ya looking at 1/2 a days job.....  same as a box change innit

capri v8 driver

hello tony,

i did not know your exhaust runs under the gearbox.

still, i woud take the oil pan off of the gearbox and take a look. if dave is right and you had problems whit the cooler and oil before, it coud be that there is dirt in the pan. whitch gets sucked up true the screen and after it passed the pump and convertor, into the valvebody, jaming the valves and screwing up the seals. because heat and dirt are the main enemy's off a automatic, i woud not take that chance, and pull the pan.

i know you don't like the idea, but you dont want to get stranded somewhere (maybe here in holland) either.

its also a good idea to start using a remote filter, because that screen does not filter much.

greetz paul.
capri v8 driver.

greetz Paul.

Capri V8 Driver.

maddoldbugger

paul

i do have to make a decision i agree, but since the A4DLe is not going to be in the car for long it seems a waste of time working on it.
as i say the end product is the r55 box,( a 5 speeder!) i would like to keep it on the road for now,
the controler i need for the new box is $970 so not exactly odd change!!

i am working through a process of upgrades, i have done the torque converter and this has saved me over 1 sec on my 0 to 60 times, (now 7.1 secs,,not bad for auto)
the next upgrade is the diff, i have a twin cam diff, 3.92 to replace the 3.65 granny cosworth item. this should also save me 1 sec or so, but i need to prove this before progressing.
i just need to prove each step so i really dont wish to work on a box, i can get around it the car as it is, no 4th gear idnt a biggy
i just need to get this diff in and tested before i dump the box...

the only question i have "will it last"

i know it seems a waste of time to many but if i know the result of each mod i will be in a position to advise on the best/cheap/ easy ways to get the auto box to be faster. the T/C mod is a very impressive gain but is the lower diff ratio going to be better? but for now i need to keep the A4DLe so i can relate to other cars, the r55 is the point where people will not follow.

tony

tony

capri v8 driver

hello tony,

i have bin looking at the 5r55s or 5r55e myself for the blue capri v8, but i put that on hold at this moment. first i need to finish the black capri v8 and some other things like my study.

but the 5r55 is a very stout transmission, you need a controller for this box. i tought you already made one.

Quotethe r55 is the point where people will not follow.


i think because this transmission is unknown for the most people, like the old saying goes: if one sheap is over the bridge, the rest is intressed to. give it a few year's and more and more people are gone use it for there conversions as the price for the controller's and part's goes down.

Quotethe only question i have "will it last"


i can't give you a answer on that. whit bit off luck it will hold. if the car is only used for testing you can take that chance. but if it need's to go long distances, i woud check it out, just to be sure. i don't like to get stranded some where. but thats just me talking.

greetz paul.
capri v8 driver.

greetz Paul.

Capri V8 Driver.

maddoldbugger

paul
the controler i made was for the A4DLE. it is no good for the r55 apart from it not controling all the gears there are other issues

i think there is not going to be the interest in the r55 as they are not that common, mine is from a 1997 explorer, i am going to swap the rear nose to make it RWD.
mind i have looked at fitting the type 9 4x4 backend on it,, i think its do-able

tony

capri v8 driver

August 27, 2007, 08:34:54 AM #14 Last Edit: August 27, 2007, 11:18:03 AM by capri v8 driver
pcs has a nice controller:

http://www.powertraincontrolsolutions.com/content-4.html]http://www.powertraincontrolsolutions.com/content-4.html and it can be used whit a padle shifter.

but it is $700.- whit the dollar low at this moment, it coud be intresting to look at.

as for not common: ford used them in the jaguar, mustangs, explorer and several other cars for the last 5 years in rwd and 4x4 configuration. it will not be a plug and play gearbox for the v6, but it can be done. if there are more company's that gone make controler's for it, the price's for it will drop and than it will be intresting to use this gearbox.

greetz paul.
capri v8 driver.
greetz Paul.

Capri V8 Driver.

maddoldbugger

yes paul
and with the loom to fit it it works out at $970

thats exactly where i am going, it will come programed up with a base program, also apart from the vss, it will just plug in and go

tony

Dave


Tone this is what my mate said

If new oil + filter & the removal of any dirt if any don't work:

"problem is most likely the one way clutch (sprag) in the front half of the box.  Is possible to repair the box but if its done a lot of miles may be better to do a complete rebuild while it's out."

Time for that new box me thinks

maddoldbugger

thanks dave.

car is still driving around if i select d3 im fine, mind what is odd, about 45 mph i can select 4th gear if i select d!
it doesnt change down tho other than kickdown.

the odd time in d3 it will pull away in 2nd, so i need to select d1 but loose all drive in d2.

regardless whats wrong, it must be debris in the box so aint worth working on, its bound to be everywhere  by now..

i feel a r55 coming on soon

tony

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